| M608 |
Okay, erm, have you always lived in Stranraer? |
| M194 |
Are ye recordin? |
| M608 |
We are now. |
| M194 |
Yes, I have that. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
oh for about sixty-eight years. |
| M608 |
Sixty-eight years? |
| M194 |
Yes. |
| M608 |
And you we- you went to school there? |
| M194 |
Yes. |
| M608 |
uh-huh. |
| M194 |
I did that. |
| M608 |
uh-huh and when, what age would you be when you left school? |
| M194 |
eh fourteen. |
| M608 |
Fourteen. |
| M194 |
In them days it was fourteen when I left school. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And I think it was about nineteen forty, forty-eight, it came in you had to stay till you were sixteen. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
Aye it was and that, |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
so ye |
| M608 |
So what was your first job? |
| M194 |
[?]I was[/?] an electrician,
//Apprentice ele-// |
| M608 |
//And that was in Stran-// |
| M194 |
Apprentice electrician |
| M608 |
In Stranraer? |
| M194 |
Yes, started in nineteen forty-seven. |
| M608 |
And who got you the job? |
| M194 |
eh |
| M608 |
Did you apply for it? |
| M194 |
mmhm applied for it
And that my father knew the the contractor, |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
and I got a job with him then.
This was just the end of the War, and they were just startin up, all, most small firms were just startin up on their own then, and you got the job with them
//then.// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh//
So it's quite a small company? |
| M194 |
Yes, there were only aboot six of us altogether, the [inaudible]
and I was there until nineteen fifty-three! |
| M608 |
So what's that, five years? |
| M194 |
Five years till I'd done my apprenticeship. [cough] In them days, you only done your apprenticeship, then they paid ye off. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Because they could pay a man fourth, er, a apprentice in third and fourth year, journeyman, could claim journeyman's wages for him,
//and// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
get to only pay you the small wages. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Once ye come yer time finished eh, ye got the yer jotters, and ye had to go look some other place. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
So then I went from there up tae Glasgow. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then a year up in Glasgow with the Ministry of Works. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Then I come back to Stranraer.
And I had a wee spell off, and then I went out to, eh Cairnryan Road [inaudible] and dump, the boats that's dumpin the ammunition. |
| M608 |
How did that, how did that work? I mean whi-, who brought the ammunition in? Was it
//the// |
| M194 |
//They came in by train// |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
Then you you loadit them ontae barges, and then they're tooken out as ye're seein it now in the paper, this [inaudible] [?]Dyke[/?], |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
and dumped there.
//The car-// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh// |
| M194 |
the crates were just threw over the, the barges just opened their tail- tailgate and threw the stuff out. |
| M608 |
And how did you get involved in that? |
| M194 |
Well I was I was unemployed.
I hadnae a job. I, because I came back from Glasgow, because the job in Glasgow finished, and I had to come back to Stranraer. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
I went there for aboot, oh aboot three weeks,
and then I got a job with with, what in them days, eh it was "Silver City" |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
that was flying from west, from eh Castle Kennedy, [inaudible] Castle Kennedy
to eh Belfast. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And I was eh I was workin there for about four month, and then I started as a
as a ba- goin back to my trade at Cairnryan, with the Royal Engineers, an electrician [?]for them[/?] at Cairnryan
//You know.// |
| M608 |
//mmhm okay.// |
| M194 |
So I did.
//and then// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh// |
| M194 |
I was there for aboot a year and a half. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And then I left there and went to the Post Office. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
I was thirty-eight year there. |
| M608 |
Thirty-eight years in the
//Post Office?// |
| M194 |
//Thirty years, aye.// |
| M608 |
And what? Was it just difficult finding work in, as an
//electrician, aye?// |
| M194 |
//oh yes phew, yes//
aye
I'd have had to move away
to say up tae, come up tae aboot Ayr, or some place. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
I mean, when I was in Glasgow and the job was finishin, I got offered work,
//it was away// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
up in Aberdeen. |
| M608 |
Right, yeah. |
| M194 |
So I just didn't fancy goin away up to Aberdeen
//and stayin// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
there and payin
I mean, and the company I was gonnae work for, they werenae gonnae give me eh money tae pay yer digs, ye'd tae pay yer digs oot of yer, yer wages
//and that was-// |
| M608 |
//[click]// |
| M194 |
uh that wasn't on. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
So I come back home again. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
and then I start the Post Office [cough] |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
aye I did. |
| M608 |
So were you, were you growing up as a child in in Stranraer during the War? |
| M194 |
Yes. |
| M608 |
uh-huh
//er. Was there a lot of// |
| M194 |
//Yes, yes right through during the War.// |
| M608 |
activity in Stranraer, cause it
//was a port?// |
| M194 |
//Oh ye-//
oh yes, during [inaudible] I went from, aboot nineteen forty-one it started.
and eh, then they built the military two, they built on one side of the the Loch Ryan, they built eh the Americans came in, and they built a jetty, and all that, for S- the Sunderlands and seaplanes. |
| M608 |
ah right. |
| M194 |
They were one side of the jetty whe when they had big hangars. They had a big, well one big hangar, where they took the planes in and repaired them. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then they had, oh f- about fourteen s- more, just like shelters, where they could put the plane, take the pla- nose the plane in and the, and they [?]tae a[/?] and they repaired them and put them back out. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And then they pulled them along the road, and they put them back intae the water. |
| M608 |
Alright. |
| M194 |
And the traffic, and a lot of traffic, ye could be pullin them one along the road, and the traffic's goin underneath the their wings. |
| M608 |
mhmm |
| M194 |
Double-decker buses and everything was going underneath the |
| M608 |
[click] |
| M194 |
people goin tae tae [inaudible] were gonnae, used to go under the wings the double-decker buses, |
| M608 |
God. |
| M194 |
and that. And then they would take them oot and put them in the water again. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And then they would go out, they would go out, and they went on thirty-six hour missions, flyin re- reconnaissance. |
| M608 |
Thirty-six hours |
| M194 |
Thirty-six hours a time [?]they'd tae go oot[/?] reconnaissin. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And that. And eh they'd come back in and, as they were comin back in, there's maybe another seaplane or Sunderland takin off tae go away back oot.
Then we would bring them in and eh when once they hit the water, they brought them up to their moorings. |
| M608 |
[cough] |
| M194 |
And there was one or two accidents that way. Some of them didnae [inaudible] some of them just missed it, and they took a nose-dive and just
//sunk.// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
And there was other ones [inaudible] ferryin up, the the pilot lost his head! |
| M608 |
[inhale] ouch |
| M194 |
[?]Don't know where[/?] just too far in he just caught the propeller. |
| M608 |
uh-huh
//Right.// |
| M194 |
//and just [inaudible]//
So [inaudible] so, that was that the the the end of the War. The short- Harland and Wolff, come into Stranraer, and they were
transm-
convertin these seaplanes into passenger planes and flyin them out to New Zealand and eh Australia,
//as passenger// |
| M608 |
//huh// |
| M194 |
planes |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
That lasted until about nineteen fifty-six, nineteen fifty-six.
//So// |
| M608 |
//Right.// |
| M194 |
[inaudible] that side, that was on one side of the water.
//On the other// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh// |
| M194 |
side of the water, they built two big jetties, so they did.
And everything was brought in by by rail to Cairnryan, and it had to even cross main, from the de- once it left the main crossing, the railway crossin, they crossed two main roads
and right alongside, and s- and into Cairnryan the [inaudible] into Cairnryan, they built a great big jetty there,
two je- they made one, two, three, they made three jetties; one s- two small ones, one big one.
And they could bring the boats in there and and take troops out durin the War and everything. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And the, at the mai- at the mai- [cough] at the main jetty, the, they don't know the de- the depth of the water, because the the, it's built on floatin, because they couldnae, the [?]repair[/?] drivers, they couldnae get the bottom. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
So it's in a, er it's in floa- a floatin dock. |
| M608 |
Good God. Right? |
| M194 |
[inaudible], and the the oh the troops used to come in there, and, in fact
then, w- the American plane, the American boats used to come in durin the night, and eh
off one boat would c- would come the [?]chassis[/?] |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
They'd go oot, they'd pull it up tae the next one, the engine, and the bodywork would go ontae it; the engine and the [?]cab[/?], and all that, would go ontae it. And they took it up to the next one, and they loaded it up wae ammunition and goo- eh whatever supplies, and all that, and then took it away to where it was goin. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
[?]So that was one of the trades of War[/?]
And eh, [cough]
And then du-, of course, during the time too, there's other bringin troop boats in and loadin it. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
And eh twice durin the War once the Queen Mary came in, durin the night, wae troops |
| M608 |
Really? |
| M194 |
And put them off, and then, of course, they were goin onto the trains, and then they took them away on the trains to wh- down intae England and wherever they were goin, and the Queen Mary was in once too. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
all durin the night, cause it was tae that deep water they could bring them in there |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
and get back oot again. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And that's where the American boats come in too, loaded wae troops, loaded wae troops and with the supplies. |
| M608 |
uh-huh
//So.// |
| M194 |
//Then.// |
| M608 |
They they'd be coming across from America? |
| M194 |
Down from America. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
mmhm
//And their// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
troops, [inaudible] troops, eh most of the troops, maybe come through, are comin out through Belfast.
//The troop boats,// |
| M608 |
//Right.// |
| M194 |
are comin in, because they come in fae d- eh, in through Dublin and up through Dublin tae Belfast, and then transferred across here. |
| M608 |
Where did you find out about this as a child? I mean,
were these
//stories coming// |
| M194 |
//[inaudible]//
ye knew what was goin on. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
You knew what was goin on, I mean. |
| M608 |
People talked about it at school?
//about it at school?// |
| M194 |
//Aye well, I mean I mean I mean//
[inaudible] and then the w- the peoples, the surveilling workers that was workin there |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And then, of course, the the troops was comin into Stranraer at night time |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
and then there's t- eh two canteens, there's the WVS
And the ri- and the Church of Scotland.
They had
//places there.// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
So troops were comin in there and then, of course, they were going tae the pictures and intae the cafes and all that.
So ye, ye get tae know some of them and ye could talk to them. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And then of c- [coughs] through too also, too was my mother worked in the WVS and the Church of Scotland's canteen, eh
//in her, voluntary work, at night// |
| M608 |
//Okay, aye.// |
| M194 |
ts- three, four hours a day.
Plus, we got to know some of them and, they came to the house
//some of the// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh// |
| M194 |
soldiers and airforcemen came to the house,
//so ye// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
got it all through that John.
And that, and then, plus too durin the War, they used to he- bring in eh troops intae eh wounded troops, in by plane, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
by hi- Sunderlands and seaplanes in, and used to bring them into the harbour at Stranraer, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and then they're transferred from there ontae buses |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
The wounded were travelled o- into ambulances and buses and they were either took to eh to eh [inaudible] which is aboot
five mile [inaudible] |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
They take t- there and some was transferred to eh
Turnberry, to Turnberry big hotel. |
| M608 |
Turnberry Hotel was used for |
| M194 |
Turnberry Hotel was a t-t- a a h-h- hospital durin the War. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
And then there's some to go up Turnhouse at Edinburgh. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
The troops
//wounded// |
| M608 |
//oh right.// |
| M194 |
then and then when and then when them that was fit was fit, they were put on the train and took away down to camps in England. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And then the troops that was coming in to get out again, they would come in, in lorries. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then the place where where the rugby pitch is now in Stranraer, used to be a transit camp. |
| M608 |
[click] Right. |
| M194 |
and that's where they give them a meal |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and then they put [inaudible] back intae the lorries, and then they went down, and they used to and ye could sometimes in Stranraer, from the harbour, they'd be a mile a mile queue, a mile of lorries up eh
from the harbour up along sta-, [inaudible] Drive and right oot the London Road onto the Dumfries Road again, sittin waitin
//for boats// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
comin in to take them out. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
And if ye were out on a Sunday afternoon, walkin, ye go, quite often eh
//the// |
| M608 |
//[cough]// |
| M194 |
the troops were sittin in there, the troops were in the lorries, sittin waitin tae be transported
//to// |
| M608 |
//Right.// |
| M194 |
the boats
And the troops would all s- shout at ye tae ah tae post letters for them.
//They'd written// |
| M608 |
//Right.// |
| M194 |
letters and they wanted somebody tae post them |
| M608 |
mmhm,
//so did you,// |
| M194 |
//So// |
| M608 |
did you post letters for them? |
| M194 |
Aye ye po- letters, aye sometime ye'd see me wae a great pile, maybe aboot thirty, maybe aboot thirty letters ye had in yer hand |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
tae tae post, on a Sunday |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
mmhm
And that, and then they went away and then that was they went from from the
there's three ferries up from Dover, the Twickenham and all these ferries were up from Dover |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And they were f- sailin from Stranraer. There's two passenger boats and then there's one, two, three, four, eh cargo boats,
which they come up the, they had the, you could run the the eh the right way on the eh Dover tae Calais run,
//They still// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
they still had the tracks for the the trains tae go on. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
So they used to put the trains onto the boats. |
| M608 |
oh right. |
| M194 |
And they had them that way, and then they used to come, they were there tr- ferryin troops on on the lorries and that, across to Belfast
//across to Belfast// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
and then some had to be taken down tae Dublin, and then they were taken off after that tae wherever they're wantin tae go tae Dublin. |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
So ye'd ye'd, so ye had quite a few |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
boats, and then [inaudible] Cairnryan
and ye had the boats comin oot and in the whole time |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then, as I'm sayin, after the War the- they'd that much old ammunition and stuff to dump. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
Well, then they'd take them out on these barges, and dump it in the water. Plus, eh they had maybe one or two old eh liners, that was ready for scrappin. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
So what they done wi them, they brought them in |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Mean they took the engines out them |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
Towed them intae Cairnryan, and then they filled them full of eh all these ammunitions, and
//ra- eh// |
| M608 |
//[inaudible]// |
| M194 |
took whatever ye could cry, any scrap |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then two tugs would come |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and take it out tae aboot, tae the deep channel. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then they'd sc- eh open the the calks |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and sink the boats. |
| M608 |
So they'd scuttle them? |
| M194 |
Aye, scuttle them. |
| M608 |
wow |
| M194 |
They too- took the tugs off tae get in, they scu- they'd open the ho- eh the holes |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
And then th- they would come off, and the tugs would just let them go, and then they just scuttled theirself. I'm sure there were aboot six boats doon that way. |
| M608 |
Nobody was worried about dumping ammu-
//ammunition at this time?// |
| M194 |
//No, no//
that's why the the the present day, they're kickin up a row |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Because, I mean, this this stuff [inaudible], well I dare say the stuff in the boats'll no be breakin loose, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
But the stuff that was taken out in the the aircraft erm [click]
the barges |
| M608 |
yup |
| M194 |
and then they just, they were in cases |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
no the stuff was just in ca- wooden cases. |
| M608 |
So what kind of stuff are we ta-, are we talkin about, just bullets or what? |
| M194 |
Bullets, eh rockets, eh or hand-grenades |
| M608 |
God! |
| M194 |
There's sten guns, everything, John. They've takin out the [inaudible] and the likes of the hand-grenades and old eh bullets, and, and eh all that;
they were in boxes.
Well then, they just took them out and they dumped them, but now the boxes are breakin up. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And this stuff, the stuff oot the boxes is startin to drift tae inland. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And its comin, [inaudible], at the present moment, ye can see roughly from eh
Ireland right acr- right round tae about, right across, right round the coast
[?]Cork[/?], eh Portpatrick, [?]Corstal[/?], and up maybe up and then up to Ballantrae, up to Ballantrae up maybe as far as Girvan |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and then even into Stranraer ye'll get an odd flare comin in ye'll see
//the thing on the shore.// |
| M608 |
//God.//
mmhm |
| M194 |
and now there are, mean there are warnins the noo just tae, if ye see one, no tae touch it. |
| M608 |
Yeah. |
| M194 |
Cause if ye can t-, if ye, they're lyin there and if you just touch them, they start flarin. |
| M608 |
God.
//So they're still, they're still dangerous// |
| M194 |
//So, they//
//they're still dangerous, aye.// |
| M608 |
//after about fifty years?//
mm |
| M194 |
I mean, they're tryin to make out that they're no dangerous, but they are |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
[inaudible]
//[inaudible]// |
| M608 |
//but no-//
nobody was worried about this at the
//time?// |
| M194 |
//No, they//
nobody was worried, they just take them tae dump, I mean these barges were, maybe two barges a day was goin oot |
| M608 |
For how long? |
| M194 |
ooh I'd say aboot two year. |
| M608 |
Two, two year? |
| M194 |
Two years, easy. |
| M608 |
Two pa- two barges a
//day for two years?// |
| M194 |
//day, yes, aye.//
I mean, and, I mean, most in most cases too, I mean, it's not to be said, but I mean the barges were supposed to go oot so far |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then open their tailgates |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
But if you're in a hurry what's gon-, what are ye gonnae do? |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
They're gonnae open them before ye should |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And that's how I think ye've got some of these stuff that's comin in now. |
| M608 |
Yeah.
//So is the stuff// |
| M194 |
//[inaudible] it is.// |
| M608 |
the stuff that wasn't sunk in
//the right place?// |
| M194 |
//[inaudible] proper places// |
| M608 |
mmhm
//And you di-, you were,// |
| M194 |
//er// |
| M608 |
you were part of this yourself
//for a while?// |
| M194 |
//Aye.//
//From the// |
| M608 |
//How long did you// |
| M194 |
Well I was going to say aboot two weeks I was on it |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
but then, when I went to work at Cairnryan eh with, that was with the with the MOD, I worked for about a fortnight
then I went, when I went to work for the eh Royal Engineers |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
well we had the electrical work tae, we had the, all the electric cranes and all that tae look after |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
so, I mean, they were doin it then,
//it was.// |
| M608 |
//mmhm//
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then, well I mean, some of these boats it was, when some of the boats too came in, they were old boats and there was Chinamen on them, there's China,
//people// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
eh crews.
//And they// |
| M608 |
//mm// |
| M194 |
of course, they were un- unloadin it from their boat,
onto the deck, and then into another one of these boats to sit- take out. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
So ye'd all that tae look after |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Aye ye had |
| M608 |
So what were these, where were the Chinese people coming from? |
| M194 |
They were bring- they were comin in these boats that's bringin the stuff in.
//There were some// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
boats comin from oh abro- abroad. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
In with the the stuff to Cairnryan
//to be dumped.// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh//
So it was coming in from all over
//the place?// |
| M194 |
//[inaudible]//
oh aye. It was comin in by train and comin in by boats. |
| M608 |
God. So, it's comin an armaments dump
//for the world, basically?// |
| M194 |
//[inaudible]//
mmhm aye.
I mean, ye'd the trains comin in every day.
and then the sometime ye'd maybe hae two boats would come in
and they'd dump it, put it on the, they'd usually try to arrange that there's another another old boat tae goin away tae be sunk |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and then they'd just transfer them from one boat, the cranes transferred them onto the onto the jetty, and they went along a bit into another cr- crane and then up and into this old boat tae be dumped. |
| M608 |
mmhm
That's amazin.
//[inaudible]// |
| M194 |
//oh d- aye!//
Aye, it went on for years.
//Aye.// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
did.
I mean now, n-n- now the pier is eh the the main dock is now u- eh it canna be used, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
because th- it's been, it wasnae prop- mai- it's no maintained since the, the er government finished with it. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
[?]Barr[/?], the contractor had it for a while.
He was haein boats comin in, and takin eh boulders, three inch, but eh, what do ye call the three-inch eh stones?
b- eh pebbles and all that.
Three inch chips and all that, takin them away,
for building harbours [inaudible]. Ye'd boats from Shetlands, eh, Orkneys and everything, any place, they come in.
They were hauling this from the big quarry up above Cairnryan, down in and then through [inaudible] goin over these big lorries
//And the,// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
the, she was just a wooden ramp. |
| M608 |
[click]
//Right.// |
| M194 |
//The w- the//
base of the jetty is just wood |
| M608 |
Yeah. |
| M194 |
So there's big holes comin in it, so they
//claimed it// |
| M608 |
//God.// |
| M194 |
unsafe. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
And that, and that. I mean it's n- it's [?]well they think they're[/?]
I noticed this morning, comin up that they must've they've opened the gates again, so they must be doing something with it. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
[inaudible] |
| M608 |
I mean, were there any accidents at the time, were there any explosions or anything? |
| M194 |
No, never any explosions
//John, no.// |
| M608 |
//er//
//mm// |
| M194 |
//Fortunately,//
there were never any
//explosion,// |
| M608 |
//mm// |
| M194 |
an all that,
//out of the boats// |
| M608 |
//mm// |
| M194 |
when they were loadin the boats, or that |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
I mean there's one or two scares, one or two maybe caught fire then. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
but they got them put oot. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
One of may- the barges maybe, on the barges or one of the boats was unloadin, they got, but they always had, I mean there's like a fire-tender, belonging to the WD, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
standin by the whole time. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
[inaudible] that was needed, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
so it was.
And there used to be aboot, roughly aboot eh now, aboot eight men at a time on the hold, loadin the, liftin the boxes intae a ple- [inaudible] |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then liftin them up and another basket would come doon and ye put it in again, |
| M608 |
All right? |
| M194 |
and that
//And that and then they would// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
just go, as I was sayin, go along with an old like an old [?]railway carriage[/?] across to the next boat and lift it and put it in. Another eight men packin it, so they had.
And that, and then they all waited, they waited till the tide suited and then they pulled it oot. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And just scuttled it, so they did.
There was quite a lot of things went on durin the War
in
Stranraer, and all that, and then of course we had the h- the the, well then we had aeroplanes in [inaudible] |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and we had Castle Kennedy, and we had eh eh Blairgowan, where eh Blairgowan, Blairgowan was a kind of repair station.
It was up in amongst the trees.
//They// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
had the hangars, where they |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
could take the planes and repair them, and then they brought them down, and then across the, across the main r- they had to take off again |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
They'd start away in the field, and they'd go across the main [?]Drumoor[/?] Road, and then along, still along a field, and then up and away. |
| M608 |
mmhm
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
//So ye had//
that was in Blairgowan |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
and Castle Kennedy, well then ye had a big drome at Castle Kennedy. |
| M608 |
Yeah. |
| M194 |
And then we had another big one down at Wigtown. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
At Ludness.
//So we did.// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
And then we, and then we had a two qu- we'd one, two, three eh camps for s- soldiers. |
| M608 |
Yeah. |
| M194 |
oh when, and then that wis
//because we had soldiers// |
| M608 |
//Right?// |
| M194 |
here, ye know for guardin
//and then we had// |
| M608 |
//mm// |
| M194 |
quite a few ack-ack guns and searchlights, and all that, so these ch- soldiers were brought round to different bits of the coast, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
for, say, twenty-four hour spells. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And the huts for the men to stay in in |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
durin the twenty-four hour spells |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
in case anything |
| M608 |
What did Uncle Robert do during the War? |
| M194 |
He was a bus driver. |
| M608 |
oh right. |
| M194 |
And and eh it eh if the likes of one of these eh
be- hospital boats was cau- planes and boats and that, they were eh they had to go down the pier with the buses
and take them maybe t- don't know where they took the troops |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
and plus they had two of their buses converted, two thi- two of the thirty-seater buses converted and they had ten stretchers in each bus. |
| M608 |
Right, so |
| M194 |
It's for takin troops away, and then ye'd as many ambulances. |
| M608 |
That's right. |
| M194 |
So so that's why the the bus drivers, they werenae, they were eh exempt from being called up, because they were |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
they were eh thingmied eh, I mean.
I've seen Uncle Robert comin in at eh half past six at night for his tea and eight o'clock he's away oot |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
a- they've got word there's a plane comin in |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
Planes comin in wae troops, wounded troops, or a boat comin in with wounded troops.
And that, and eh then they've got tae go down, and sit down the pier |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and wait till they come in and see where they'd to be transferred tae |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
As I'm saying sometimes, they'd could transfer, be transferrin them up tae Turnberry, or maybe away t- tae Turnberry or tae, tae
tae Newhouse, any place like that, where the hospital, or up t- even up tae eh Loch [inaudible] |
| M608 |
mmhm [click]
//mm// |
| M194 |
//So they could//
That do that durin the night |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
and then come back and do their normal duty during the day. |
| M608 |
That's right, cause ye told me a story last time ab- Uncle Robert, on the first double-decker bus.
Wha- was, what was that one again? |
| M194 |
we- Uncle Robert, when the first double-decker was tae come intae Stranraer. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
Yes, well, I mean, they never had the double-decker buses, this is way back in nineteen, nineteen thirty-eight, thirty, thirty-seven, thirty-eight. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
The first double-decker bus they got in, and, of course, at that time they were gettin ready for a, I think it would be the, it was maybe the coronation. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
I'd need tae think, the corona-, so they put the streamers up and the the lights and all that. They'd put them up |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
So, of course Uncle Robert, on the first mornin, he came down.
They'd been putting them up say at the weekend, the Monday mornin, he came down and he, when he turned into King Street, from there on till he got right up King Street, right down George Street, till he got tae the Post Office,
he could hear ping, ping, ping, ping, ping, but he didn't know what was goin on.
And when he got to the Post Office, tae collect the mail tae take it tae [?]Sandhead[/?] and [?]Drumore[/?] and all that, the postman came out and said yer bus is fancily d- eh decorated this mornin. How? Here he was all was all these de- all these buntins and lights and everything all lying at the front of the double-decker [laugh] |
| M608 |
[laugh] |
| M194 |
Cause they hadnae, ye know, put them high enough. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
And they just took the whole lot away with him. |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
So they had tae start and re- hi- ra- hi- put them up higher for the sake of the double-decker. |
| M608 |
[?]comes down[/?] |
| M194 |
It was the first double-decker they'd bo- bought into Stranraer. |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
And that's what happened tae him.
He always said that,
the first bus that came intae Stranraer and he p- eh took the buntin down for them, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
so they did, oh aye. |
| M608 |
Why did the American, why did the Americans come to the house? |
| M194 |
Well they would, they, no they never came to my house.
//But they// |
| M608 |
//oh right.// |
| M194 |
came to st- well they were in, as I'm sayin, they came and they built the airforce base at Rigg Bay, |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
which, as I'm sayin they built for the slip-ways and the huts and these big hangars for repairin the planes in |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
wh- why they they they stayed they were while they were buildin it, they were stayin in the transit camp
so they were s-s- stationed at stan- transit camps and they had to by erm take them by bus from the Stranraer to Rigg Bay. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
They took them away out, they took them out about six in the morning and they went half-past eight again, ye started bringin them back intae Stranraer for their breakfast. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
So ye go- brought them in for their breakfast and the drivers got their breakfast along wi them. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then, of course, again they brought them in for their lunch |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
at dinner time, and then they s- brought them in for their tea. Usually when they brought them in their tea, for their tea at night-time, that was them finished, because, I mean, they couldnae see in the dark, |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
cause ye werenae allowed lights or nothing and that, in them days, so ye were
So that's what the- they had tae trans- be transported oot and in, and then and then before fir- eh that was it, that was it eh and the ones that was finished they went away. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Well ye'd the odd American comin in wi planes |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
they came away wi planes, or, or sometimes ye'd the odd American comin in tae but of course we'd American, South Africans, everything |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
airforce men comin in t-, maybe to learn how to [?]fly[/?]. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And then, of course, w-wh- westwing [?]as I was sayin[/?] at [inaudible], well that was a quite a big eh eh quite a few planes there too.
And then has got quite a big house up about [inaudible] |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and the the the airforcemen slept there. |
| M608 |
[click] Right. |
| M194 |
But then they had tae be transported too, from [inaudible] [laugh] to [inaudible] for their meals. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
And eh Uncle Robert done all that. |
| M608 |
So there was a lot of running
//around.// |
| M194 |
//ah//
runnin around aye, and I mean in them days it was seven days a week ye were drivin, and no just
//and that.// |
| M608 |
//[inaudible]//
Stranraer feel about the Americans?
//[?]Did they find[/?]// |
| M194 |
//[?]eh they[/?]//
just took them, they took them in, just
//Aye.// |
| M608 |
//Took them as they found them.// |
| M194 |
aye as they found them aye.
//They got// |
| M608 |
//Aye.// |
| M194 |
on okay with them. |
| M608 |
No difficulty communicatin with
//them, mm?// |
| M194 |
//No.//
No.
cause they werenae that, they we- they werenae that long there John, maybe say aboot, six month, they, we had a, we had a large sum of troops wi- while they're buildin the jetty and that at Cairnryan. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
And then, of course, just after that it was just odd yins, we'd of course we'd every nationality: Jamaicans, South-Africans, Americans comin
//Over to West-// |
| M608 |
//uh-huh// |
| M194 |
[inaudible], to Rigg Bay |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
first to learn how tae fly planes and all these, fly th- ye know that type of plane, so ye had. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Ah we'd all nationalities during the War.
and that eh, and then, of course, two, the army had a place some [?]dead-tree[/?] places at Cairnryan, three big camps at Cairnryan.
Then up eh just about a mile out of Stranraer, maybe a mile, a mile and a half, they'd another lot of eh army troops, they'd the Royal Engineers, they were in another camp |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
where the si- because they they built the railway |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
the Royal Engineers built the railway from from the siding eh the [inaudible] railway siding to Cairnryan. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Well, they were stationed up there and then, of course, there's eh the troops would come from Cairnryan ri- eh, at night-time
by train
//intae// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
what they cried the [inaudible] and then they'd di- they got off there and they'd have about a mile tae walk intae town |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
And everything, then of course they had a las- si- the last train at night was aboot eleven o'clock, back tae Cairnryan. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Quite a few of them didnae make it [laugh] and they had tae walk tae
//Cairnryan.// |
| M608 |
//[laugh]// |
| M194 |
That's when they [inaudible] in at the pictures or that or, |
| M608 |
uh-huh |
| M194 |
at the pubs and all that.
they just had tae get on with it. |
| M608 |
Yeah. |
| M194 |
oh aye, and I mean, and I mean, di- down the, the especially on a Saturday, the wee restaurants restaurants in Stranraer were chock-a-block |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
I mean, the chaps come in and they'd maybe go tae the canteen at di- at three o'clock, and get a cup of tea, and then they'd hae a wander round the toon gettin odds and ends like shavin cream and and all these kind of things, stuff,
and then they'd maybe go to some of the wee cafes and have a, their tea |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
then go to the first or second house of the pictures |
| M608 |
mmhm
Were there many picture houses in
//Stranraer?// |
| M194 |
//There was//
two at that time. |
| M608 |
oh right. |
| M194 |
And then, well then ye had eh, both picture houses done a show at six o'clock and then a c- a quarter past eight |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Both of them, and then they changed the films every three times a week |
| M608 |
Changed the film three times |
| M194 |
times a week.
So, of course, there's queues there ye mean, eh if ye wanted intae the pictures, it didnae matter whether it was the second house or the first house ye went tae, ye had to be down aboot roughly half an hour before the picture started if ye wanted to be near the front of the queue
//kind of style.// |
| M608 |
//Aye.// |
| M194 |
cause of that many queuin up. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
and that [?]yes a did[/?], aye.
oh aye they thingmied and then [sniff] and then the canteens so then the canteens too they could get cooked meals. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
So they could, but most of them just wanted a cup of tea and maybe a scone and a cake.
And then at that time, well I mean, eh durin the War our, our, sweets and chocolates were rationed. |
| M608 |
Right. |
| M194 |
eh rationed. Well then they used to ha- eh have a supply every day there usually some they sold so many in the afternoon and so many at night in the canteens. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
Well the troo-, the troops the, some of the troops used to get fly
and they all, whenever they opened in the afternoon they sell the ch- chocolates
//So it meant// |
| M608 |
//Right.// |
| M194 |
that some of them, it was the same people who was gettin them every time. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
So what they had to do was vary it
ye know, so instead of getting it first thing in the afternoon, they maybe had to get it half-past three, four o'clock or that
//so// |
| M608 |
//Right.// |
| M194 |
they wouldnae know,
and then some of them did come in and they would stay in the canteens and then the the ladies would say "And what are ye waitin on?
Do ye think, think ye're gonna get the sweeties first, cause you got them yesterday",
//and they had tae chase them// |
| M608 |
//[laugh]// |
| M194 |
away
So they had tae, oh aye,
and then, of course, wh- an odd time ye had tae get the the MPs and that in, just tae kinda quieten them doon.
oh everything went, I mean there wasnae all that much bother wi them, so there wasnae. |
| M608 |
So it was an exciting time for the
//town// |
| M194 |
//oh//
t- aye, aye.
I mean the only thing is ye had no lights, ye couldnae see where ye were goin. |
| M608 |
[laugh] |
| M194 |
Ye had tae go, but then, of course, th- and the torches in yer torch, ye had tae have a piece of eh
greaseproof paper in it.
so that yer light wouldnae be |
| M608 |
reflected? |
| M194 |
reflected.
//kind of// |
| M608 |
//Aye.// |
| M194 |
just a wee a wee dot.
And then and the the the cars and the buses, well their headlamps was filled in.
and ye just had, on the likes of the buses, they had eh one strip about an inch wh- wide
for aboot four inches long
and then they'd one, another doon below that aboot two and a half inches long
and then one at the bottom, aboot an inch |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
just an- for aboot maybe [gesture] that?
//for// |
| M608 |
//mmhm// |
| M194 |
and that was and that was yer light, and ye had tae s- kinda try and see in that. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
And then, of course, ye had tae have yer inside lights in yer buses dimmed too. |
| M608 |
mmhm course there wasnae the traffic. |
| M194 |
No, but then the, we, [inaudible] there wasnae so much traffic then, ye still had the military, we had still the m-
//military movin aboot.// |
| M608 |
//Aye, true.//
uh-huh mmhm |
| M194 |
So we had, still the military movin aboot |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
oh t- aye oh ye never knew
And then, of course, in them days, the buses, the conductors, conductors could speak into the
conductors could speak into the driver through a window. |
| M608 |
mmhm |
| M194 |
And one night Uncle Robert was goin oot, we had taken the la- last bus to West [?]Freuch[/?] with airmen
and the next thing I, I, I, a window opened and he thought it was going to be the conductor in tae speak tae him. Here it was a Canadian with a knife at his back,
so it was.
//[laugh]// |
| M608 |
//Really?// |
| M194 |
[laugh] He wan-, he wanted father to take them some, eh some eh I canna mind where he was to be taken ah |
| M608 |
God. |
| M194 |
Aye and, of course, some of the rest of the chaps seen him and knocked him doon. |
| M608 |
mm |
| M194 |
He just, he was, he'd had too much to drink, he'd had too much tae drink, John. |
| M608 |
Aye. |
| M194 |
and he ended up he opened open the wee window and had he says "you takin me such and such a place". I mean he actually poked the knife intae intae his back. |
| M608 |
Hijack a bus. |
| M194 |
Aye hijack a double-decker bus |
| M608 |
[laugh] |
| M194 |
Fif- with fifty-five men in it, so it is, aye |
| M608 |
God. |
| M194 |
Aye [inaudible] |
| M608 |
Anyway, we're being called
//through to eat.// |
| M194 |
//[inaudible]//
tea aye |
| M608 |
Anyway, thanks very
//much.// |
| M194 |
//Thanks for it,//
John. |
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